I have been doing a lot of thinking recently and I decided that my blog wasn't really "me" enough. I edited the layout a bit and I think it better represents myself and my struggles. The idea of space and time completely baffles and amazes me, thus the picture at the top. You guys may think it's heinous, but I like it.
On a more serious note, I have been doing a lot of thinking these last few years. I have been tackling the concept of religion, morality, deities, and the afterlife. My main goal being truth, I have been searching for understanding and answers for a long time and I feel as though I have made a conclusion. Well, not a definite conclusion, I feel that the power to cogitate (I know.. good word, right?) goes hand in hand with the power to change your mind freely. I know some of you already know this, but I wanted to make a formal announcement of my current decision. I formally renounce any association with any religion - as a whole. I would now consider myself somewhere between agnostic and atheist.
I am going to go through a brief list of my reasons and explanations as best I can. Please forgive me for anything that is confusing. It is very hard to explain what goes on in my mind. Also, I want to say that I have never and do not now hold any kind of judgment towards you, my dear, dear friends, who may believe differently. It is my firm belief that if you allow me the freedom to express my thoughts and conclusions maturely, I will do the same for you. With that said, I continue...
One of my main reasons for my new belief (or lack of belief I should say..) is my issue with moral relativism. Who is to say what is right and what is wrong? I realize that there are ethical laws that must be followed by humanity in order for it to co-exist with itself. I do not deny that murder and rape are harmful to humanity as a whole. However, I cannot, nor will I ever be able to, tell you what the offender was thinking. Whenever I bring up the issue of moral relativism the holocaust always seems to be brought up. I want to say a few things about that. No I do not think Hitler should have slaughtered countless people. No I do not think that was the "right" thing to do. I cannot, however, tell you if Hitler himself, in his mind, thought he was honestly doing the right thing. He did bring prosperity to his country, among other things that can be seen as "good". I see a small parallel in what the holocaust did for Germany, and what Manifest Destiny did for this country. We came to settle California by misplacing and slaughtering not only people, but entire cultures. This was and still at times is seen as "good". I believe the Native Americans would beg to differ. I understand that it was on a much smaller scale than the holocaust, I am merely attmepting to explain the tangled web of thoughts I have.
The next thing I would like to address is how religion can be detrimental to humanity. Please note that when I speak of religion I do not solely speak of Christianity, I speak of any and all religions that exist. The amount of humans that are killed over the issue of religion is almost unbelievable. The conflicts that arise from one group of people believing they are right, and therefore better than, another could be completely avoided without the issue of religion. Oceans of blood seep into the dirt because of a "who's going to heaven the right way" battle. It seems childish and absurd in my mind. All it does is divide us into the "not so smart humans" and "saved humans" categories. The other issue I have with this is the belief that comes from thinking you are "right" or "saved". Once someone believes they are right, then in turn, everyone else is wrong, thus the former believes to be the superior being. This is NEVER a good thing, unless it's in math class.
I want to avoid making a blanket statement here. I speak of the masses, not of the religious people who are loving and tolerant. I want to exclude people like Alaina, my best friend, who through all the conversations and disagreements has continued to love me and treat me as an equal. She is in Israel serving and loving people there, and I congratulate her whole-heartedly for doing what she believes is right and for promoting humanity's general welfare. I could not thank her, and those like her, more for being so understanding and respectful of my thoughts. These are the people, regardless of what belief system they are a part of, that should run this world, for they will save it.
To me the circle of life is a beautiful thing. The way everything on our Earth works together in this perfect ecosystem is astounding. While some may see this as an argument for a higher being, I see it as an argument against. Well, I mostly see it as an argument against an afterlife. What could be more beautiful then coming from the Earth, fulfilling your life's purpose (whatever it may be), and becoming a part of her again in death? The idea of this brings me peace. Death is natural, it should not be feared. The means of death is a different story, but death itself, should not be feared. I feel that if there was somewhere else to go after this life, it would demean the importance of this life. It breeds colonies of people who are not worried about what they do here because it's where they go later that matters. What kind of life is that? Not one I want to lead.
The last thing I want to address is the issue of my happiness. I have many people say that if I reject religion I will never be "truly happy". I do not like, or agree, with this statement. I am happier than I have ever been in my entire life at this moment. I know where I have been and I do not regret it, for it has brought me to where I am today. I feel genuinely happy and I believe that I truly am. Is it the devil's trickery? If so, I have yet to see through it.
I would like to thank the people I have spoken with in the last few years for their thought provoking insights. Especially those in the more recent past. You know who you are and I love you all.
I appreciate any and all comments from you. I also could not thank you more for the time you have given my thoughts. Again, I love you all regardless of your beliefs and I hope you can do the same.
Much love,
Andie
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Hi Andie.
ReplyDeleteI really am impressed with your thoughts...and more importantly your thought process. I am at once surprised and baffled at some of the realizations you have come to for you...at this time in your life. but we'll talk about that in person one day if you'd like. I am particularly pleased that you find yourself the happiest you have ever been at this time. I feel happiness is relative....but if your happy and not sad..in gneral, then you're winning the battle.
I feel like I knew you a little before reading your update. i suppose it achieved what you were hoping for...your friends,and anyone else reding it to have a better understanding into "andie" and to this end you have prevailed. Before I forget, I want to let you know how brave I think you are for doing so in such a public forum as this. You open yourself up to the possibility of ridicule or worse!!!...someone reading this might not like what it says and decide not to be your "friend"....oh the shame :) I know when I was much younger...about your age, I thought many similar things as you..not exact...similar. Lucky for me and everyone else there wasn't a venue such as this to put my thoughts to pen, or keyboard, as it were.
I certainly think differently now than I did then and can only shudder at the post scripts and "changes" my life has taken since.
Andie, you are an articulate, well-read,tolerant,respectful, genuinly funny and thoughful young lady and I feel like I know you a little better now than before.I look forward to watching, from a distance, to see how your life and those around you unfold in the coming years (God willing...for me anyway,as i am already "old" and hope He gives me more time on this earth...if for no other reason than to see the evolution of Andie and her friends.) I do have ulterior motives, as one of your friends is of my loins, it will be interesting to "watch' your journies and when they might intersect...this is what life is really all about, for me anyway...the "human condition" is fascinating.
Well I would like to take a moment to apologize for my lack of any writing,spelling and punctuation skills....I write like a third grader...my apologizies to all third graders out there..
I wish you the best Andie. I love you and hope we can further this dialogue one day soon...or not.. it's up to you, I suppose.
from a favorite musician of mine I will leave you with one of his lyrics, of which I often come around to thinking about at moments in my life...simple but here it is.
"Well, it's only the giving that makes you....what you are"
Just a couple quick thoughts, as I had no idea you had changed your mind on God and religion.
ReplyDeleteFirst, on moral relativism...I don't see how that can push one AWAY from God, but instead it should affirm that WITHOUT God, there is no right and wrong. Speaking as a Christian, without the Bible as an instruction manual, then all that is left is moral relativism...what one person thinks and what another person and thinks, and how can either be right? But to live by an instruction manual handed down by God himself, that is the complete opposite of moral relativism.
I think we need some clarity on your statement about "The amount of humans that are killed over the issue of religion is almost unbelievable." While yes, people are killed because of religious beliefs, don't fall into the trap that it is GREATER than the number killed by the likes of Hitler, Stalin, etc. It's commonly said that religion is the greatest cause of death in the world...and it's completely false. The millions killed by the above two men and the millions murdered in Africa (just to name a few incidents) far outnumber any deaths caused by religion. My point being, that if religious violence turns you away from religion, I don't see how "secular" violence from man can lead you to embrace a world without religion either.
But going above and beyond everything I said, you failed to mention one thing: God. You talked over and over about people, and what people have done or do, but what about God? What about the amazing story of Christ, and the transformations of the people that were there to know him and see him rise from the dead? I don't deny that there are decent, non-christian people...but that is no more an argument than if there are good christian people.
I look forward to a long and valuable discussion with you Andie, because I care about you, and I think there is more for you than a pile of dust at the end of all this. An afterlife does not cheapen this life. In fact, the bible says this life is simply the beginning, and the holy spirit allows us to begin living with God NOW. Thank you for sharing all your thoughts with us, I appreciate it.
Very well cogitated and expressed! We think along the same lines, Andie. I would love to sit and discuss it with you one day. A book you might enjoy is "Think on these things" --Krishnamurti
ReplyDeleteJack Mierop
I'm curious as to your statement about moral relativism. It makes sense to say with a god of some sort there would be an ultimate right or wrong. It also makes sense that without this deity, the topic is open to discussion and interpretation. I'm just not sure how the topic in general stands in your mind as evidence against the existence of a higher being. God could potentially exist despite disagreements about morality, couldn't he? Or perhaps I am misunderstanding.
ReplyDeleteIt would definitely be nice if more religious people did everything they could to make this place better. It be much nicer for the rest of us! I really like your post though :)
Imagine how awesome this life is.
ReplyDeleteNow imagine that it has taken a step further, with no imperfections. That is what brings me peace.
And no, I don't think any of us can know what Hitler was thinking when he did those things. Maybe he really did think that it was the best thing for his country. But that desire right there is selfish. I don't care what happens to these people, I want MY country to prosper. Not caring who you murder just as long as you meet your goal is wrong no matter how you look at it.
ReplyDeleteI can tell you one thing that he wasn't thinking about, all the people he was murdering. The generations that would be lost due to his actions.
Or maybe he was thinking about that. That's even worse.
I find that Bandyface guy's comment to be an unjustified idea. A lot of religious people try to make this world a better place. This can even be tested. Consider just for a moment some charites and good done by people of faith:
ReplyDeleteRescue missions, food pantries, Invisible Children, Worldvision, Tumaini Aids sponsorship, Habitat for Humanity, Amor building projects, Mercy Ships, Christian Children's fund, Compassion, etc etc.
One may argue here, "well these people don't actually love people, they are only trying to proselytize." This, however, misses the point. We are not talking motivation; we are talking consequences of belief. And these acts of charity are the fruits of believers.
To JoshbandyFace's statement again. These are all concrete expressions of people with beliefs trying hard to change their world. Any statement saying "religious people" don't try hard to do that, that they are simply escapists, is a statement that doesn't square with reality. It is false. Notice here, we are not saying religion and violence never get intertwined. We are simply pointing out the sheer lunacy of the idea that people who believe in things are just waiting for this world to burn and aren't trying to do anything about it. This belief ignores the charity seen in Muslims, Buddhists, Hindus, Jews, and Christians to name a few.
As a side note, it is a pretty general rule of thumb in philosophical discussions to avoid sweeping statements/generalities ie All people do this or that. The idea that religious people cause violence, or the "masses" (whoever that may be) is pretty unwieldy and ambiguous and not really a great place to start for a "philosophical" discussion.
I believe the thing i said before "masses" was "I want to avoid making a blanket statement here." If the terminology upsets you, then sorry, but I did make a point that I did not mean every single person that has ever been in a religion.
ReplyDeleteI also don't think josh's comment was geared towards every single person. He said, "it would definitely be nice if MORE religious people..." not "religious people" or "all religious people".
ReplyDeleteI think you are mistaken as to what this discussion is referring to.
I concede a couple of things. You did say you wanted to avoid making a blanket statement. And you are right, Bandy guy did say "more."
ReplyDeleteThose points considered, I do not think I have misunderstood the discussion at all. To your first point, you said you didn't want to make a blanket statement, but you did anyway. The term "masses" is a massive and ambiguous and counts as a blanket statement. I think on some level I understand what you are getting at, but it should me more specifically put.
For Josh's comment the reason I read more into his statement was because I felt it addressed what you said in your blog when you wrote: "It breeds colonies of people who are not worried about what they do here because it's where they go later that matters." This too, is a fairly nebulous statement that needs qualification, but I take it to mean here that you think religion produces large amounts (how many is a colony?) of people who only focus on the next life and forget about this one. This was the idea that I was attacking, primarily because if that is what is being said, it is simply not true.
Can I add one final thought? Religion = violence; Secular = non-violence. This also is not true. Consider just momentarily the greatest mass murderers in the last century: Mao, Stalin, Pol Pot. All of them were firm non-believers. Truly great violence has been done in the name of atheism, and one could strongly argue than NON-belief causes more violence than belief, if we were only considering a very simple understanding what that meant.